Reduced 7days - Copper ban

  1. copper
  2. Steam Community :: Error

  1. No idea which admin but I know ‘cole’ told them.
  2. I was initially kicked for #11 when I was never ever in a pilot slot. I did pilot a vehicle, but I wasn’t officially in a vortex pilot slot (the only slots that exclaim that you must be in TS3). Many, many other players on your server have piloted vehicles without having the vortex role. I’ve seen none of them banned, kicked or even warned, yet as my luck would have it I was kicked for it. Any player can access an air vehicle from a non-pilot slot and switch to the pilot seat to gain controls. This is not an exploit (which I was thereafter permabanned for), it is a legitimate game mechanic. If it is your intention for non-vortex roles to be denied access from pilot seats, you must either specify this clearly in your rules or modify your seat permissions to stop people from doing it. I strongly believe this does not merit a permanent ban and the admin that issued it was very unfair. I’ve even seen a player do the exact same thing I’ve done (with admins present on the sever) and additionally that player even teamkilled other players whilst doing it without even so much as a warning message. I do enjoy playing on this server so if you’d please reconsider the ban I’d be happy to not do it again. Please be friendly and transparent with your server’s community instead of just being rude and isntantly permabaning someone for a petty issue. I’ve seen people get away with much worse so it’s quite upsetting.

This is LBJ’s ban but I do wish to make a statement.

I will say that using “other people get away with it” as an excuse is not the right way to go. If you are allowed back on our servers you need to report those incidents by typing, in an in-game message, " Admin this player is doing such and such." The word “admin” will ping all available admins and we can react to the situation.

You keep using all these “examples” of yours and yet when I am on or I see other admins on, we react to situations and no one is just allowed to break the rules. If we don’t notice something then it is YOUR responsibility as a player to inform us. You claim that you care about our rules and yet you stand by and watch other people break rules and say nothing? I’m going to call BS. You don’t care about our rules and now you’re either making up “examples” or trying to establish some moral high ground that you don’t have because you let these things happen so that you can do it yourself.
You allowing these things to happen and then using no admin response as an excuse to do it yourself is unacceptable.

On our server, most if not all of the aircraft deny the copilot or gunner the right to take controls. It is possible with vanilla Arma 3 but on our servers we have disabled this so if there are aircraft that allow this then it needs to be reported as a bug.
*Edit: I appear to have wrongly assumed that we had additional scripts in place to block gunners and copilot’s from taking controls as I have seen players get in these slots and not take controls. It is still not possible to take the pilot seat when not in a pilot slot.
You never stopped once to consider that maybe what you are doing is wrong? Rule #11 is clearly stated and our server will definitely not let you into any pilot seat if you are not in a slot. Again, you don’t care about our rules and you circumvented them and now you’re making up excuses.

Finally, nowhere in the rules does it say anything about what slot you are in. It states that if you are playing the role of pilot, uav, or ATC you must be in TeamSpeak.

Verbatim:
RULE #11) All pilots, UAV operator, and ATC must be on the NAK SQUAD TeamSpeak server (excluding NAK Elite). No pilot may be AFK.

Before I was NAK Elite I encountered something similar to this issue. Some vehicles that allow players to switch from pilot to non-pilot seats can be piloted without a Vortex Pilot slot. I won’t say how, but I reported this bug a while ago and I am not sure if it is fixed yet. Regardless, after reading the rules it is pretty obvious that doing so is dodging the principle of the rules: Pilots need to be on teamspeak to communicate with other aircraft.

This is false. Not only has Adonis testified to the loophole existing (and has for a long time over several patches and mission file changes) but you can visit the rotary aircraft area and see it for yourself.

I do agree with the rest of your post, using examples without having raised any issues prior to the ban is wrong but it doesn’t make them invalid. Other players have and will continue to use these functions to solo rotary aircraft. What I did was wrong and I acknowledge that, I’ve no intention of defending it. However, I was permanently banned for hacking/exploiting a legitimate game mechanic. I do believe that is wrong and unjust.

The bottom line is you violated server rules by piloting a vehicle while not in a pilot slot, not being in TeamSpeak as a pilot and you took advantage of a bug or loophole in Arma mechanics that allowed you to bypass our server scripts that prevent non pilots from operating air vehicles.

I initially was going to lower the ban, but the more I read your initial appeal, the more it made me believe that the ban is appropriate.

To clear up the issue over “Some vehicles that allow players to switch from pilot to non-pilot seats can be piloted without a Vortex Pilot slot.” We have chosen to enforce this with server rules rather than scripts, as using scripts to prevent switching to pilot from non-pilot seats would be a large negative impact on performance.

BOTTOM LINE
I am going to talk to the admin that issued the ban. If you took control of another air vehicle after the initial kick for Rule #11, then I am going to leave the ban as permanent. If the admin, entered the ban for “Exploiting is a form of Hacking” after additional investigation into the kick, I will recommend that you be given another chance after a 7 day ban.

REASONING
“I was initially kicked for #11 when I was never ever in a pilot slot. I did pilot a vehicle, but I wasn’t officially in a vortex pilot slot (the only slots that exclaim that you must be in TS3).” The rules clearly state (as mentioned by G0lden) “All pilots, UAV operator, and ATC must be on the NAK SQUAD TeamSpeak server (excluding NAK Elite). No pilot may be AFK.” If you were flying a vehicle you were a pilot, no matter what seat or role you were in. Your response after the kick just shows that you would rather try to find loopholes in the rules instead of trying to follow them.

" If it is your intention for non-vortex roles to be denied access from pilot seats, you must either specify this clearly in your rules or modify your seat permissions to stop people from doing it."
There is a script that prevents people from getting into the pilot seat from a non vortex slot, and the script did stop you numerous times. You then circumvented the script, by getting into the vehicle in another position and taking control. The rules do clearly state “This page does not cover all the rules; only the basic ones. If an Admin finds an unfitting behavior he will moderate it accordingly. We NAK Squad reserve the right to refuse access/service to anyone, at anytime, for any reason.”

“Many, many other players on your server have piloted vehicles without having the vortex role. I’ve seen none of them banned, kicked or even warned, yet as my luck would have it I was kicked for it.”
It seems your primary defence is you have seen other people do it, therefore it must be okay. But when you were kicked from the server for not being in TeamSpeak, instead of correcting the issue, you decided to try an challenge community guidelines. The rest of this point was coved very well by G0lden.

Shooting friendlies is a “Legitimate Game Mechanic” yet it is not permitted on our servers… I’m replying from my phone since I cannot access the website for some reason via PC so bear with me as I try to articulate what happened. Attached is a screenshot of my notes on the matter.

G0lden has already previously stated the Rule#11 which you violated. Your only defense is that you have witnessed other players using this “loop hole” and claim to be “using what was available to me”. This statement shows that the player knows and understands the rules but chooses to not abide by them.

Furthermore, your continued pretentious and complacent attitude toward others and this situation is enlighting. You have almost 30hrs on our servers and clearly showed me that you understand the rules. I’m sure this is not your first time doing this, however it was your first time being caught.

-In your eyes, you have done nothing wrong because you see other players doing it.

-In your eyes, our rules need to be changed or the mission file needs to be changed.

In OUR eyes you need to follow the rules, period. If you have a suggestion or have an issue, you can report it via the forums or talk to an Admin directly.

You mention that the actions taken got you to where you are now as “Petty”, but your reasons for them is nothing less than that… “#logic

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk



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I have spoken to LBJ the admin that entered the ban initially. Although your actions and behavior do not reflect those of someone who wishes to be a part of the NAK Community, we are going to change your ban to 7 days (from the date of the initial ban). Take this as your warning, any future attempts to circumvent server rules or restrictions will be met with a permanent ban. Remember the rules state “This page does not cover all the rules; only the basic ones. If an Admin finds an unfitting behavior he will moderate it accordingly. We NAK Squad reserve the right to refuse access/service to anyone, at anytime, for any reason.” If you are unsure if something is against server rules ask an admin.